From www_server Wed Jun 1 11:52:00 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA14375; Wed, 1 Jun 94 11:52:00 EDT Return-Path: Date: Wed, 1 Jun 94 11:51:53 EDT From: www_server@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU (httpd@fits.cv.nrao.edu) Message-Id: <9406011551.AA14366@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU, salim@mail.esrin.esa.it Subject: ESA, ESRIN, ESIS Homepages Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Message entered by: Salim Ansari @ mesis.esrin.esa.it [193.204.224.21] Dear Don, Please make url changes in your database to point to the following Homepages: ESA : http://www.esrin.esa.it/ ESRIN http://www.esrin.esa.it/htdocs/esrin/esrin.html ESIS http://www.esrin.esa.it/htdocs/esis/esis.html Thank you, Salim Ansari From www_server Wed Jun 1 15:37:36 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA14739; Wed, 1 Jun 94 15:37:36 EDT Return-Path: Date: Wed, 1 Jun 94 15:37:32 EDT From: www_server@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU (httpd@fits.cv.nrao.edu) Message-Id: <9406011937.AA14730@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU, fstauffer@sunspot.sunspot.noao.edu Subject: nso/spo staff member address corrections Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Message entered by: fritz stauffer @ xdev.sunspot.noao.edu [146.5.2.75] The htmls for the nso/spo staff have been moved. I don't expect anymore major reorganization. The old html was: http://blazing.sunspot.noao.edu/Staff/... and is now http://www.sunspot.noao.edu/General/Staff/... If you want me to send you a list of SPO people affected, let me know. fritz From astroweb-request Sat Jun 4 05:12:44 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA20529; Sat, 4 Jun 94 05:12:44 EDT Return-Path: Date: Sat, 4 Jun 94 19:12:14 EST From: anton@mso.anu.edu.au (anton koekemoer) Message-Id: <9406040912.AA19300@merlin.anu.edu.au> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: Re: MSSSO AstroWeb update Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Dear friends, I notice that the URLs http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/astroweb/url1.htm http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/astroweb/url2.htm are no longer accessible ('no permission'). Does this mean that I should remove my local copies of them? (and also revert back to my old Astroweb database, which has none of the new personal URLs I added from CDS?) cheers, - anton. From astroweb-request Sat Jun 4 05:22:42 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA20702; Sat, 4 Jun 94 05:22:42 EDT Return-Path: Message-Id: <9406040925.AA16631@SIMBAD.u-strasbg.fr> To: anton@merlin.anu.edu.au (anton koekemoer) Cc: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: Re: MSSSO AstroWeb update In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 4 Jun 94 19:12:14 EST . Date: Sat, 04 Jun 94 11:25:47 +0200 From: egret@SIMBAD.u-strasbg.fr X-Mts: smtp Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Anton, The unavailability of url1.htm and url2.htm is mainly due to some technical problems which should be solved quite soon. Sorry for that. In fact we have now decided to replace the full list by a search mechanism, more convenient for access through the net. You are welcome to keep the "personal records" from url2.htm in the AstroWeb files. I have discussed this week quite extensively with Andre about the current and future status of AstroWeb -- and your recent message, Anton, was also a good input to this discussion. I plan to send to all of you an e-mail as a result of this discussion. However I have been kept very busy with other things (a meeting to prepare). I will try to write that down over the week-end. A suivre... Best regards Daniel From astroweb-request Mon Jun 6 08:24:53 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA25726; Mon, 6 Jun 94 08:24:53 EDT Return-Path: Date: Mon, 6 Jun 94 08:24:47 EDT From: Bob Jackson Message-Id: <9406061224.AA27834@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Subject: [HDD@aaoepp2.aao.GOV.AU: adding a site] Reply-To: jackson@stsci.edu Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Date: Fri, 3 Jun 1994 16:41 +1000 From: Helen Davies Subject: adding a site To: jackson@stsci.edu Bob, I note that your database has AAT schedule (which doesnt work and was added MSO). I would like to add the official AAT/AAO WWW homepage to the list but cant seem to find the form. Could you possibly remove the AAT schedule entry and replace it with our official homepage: http://aaoepp.aao.gov.au/aaohomepage.html The description need only include the following Anglo Australian Observatory (AAO). Please contact me if you need further information. MAny thanks Cheers Helen Davies Systems Manager AAO From www_server Mon Jun 6 14:49:07 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA26363; Mon, 6 Jun 94 14:49:07 EDT Return-Path: Date: Mon, 6 Jun 94 14:49:03 EDT From: www_server@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU (httpd@fits.cv.nrao.edu) Message-Id: <9406061849.AA26354@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU, michael@cygnus.uni-muenster.de Subject: Correction for Astronomical Institute Muenster Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Message entered by: michael @ aquila.uni-muenster.de [128.176.128.67] Hi Don, could you please correct the AIM record from http://aquila.uni-muenster.de:8000/* to http://aquila.uni-muenster.de For quite a while now we are serving web pages through a combined german/english welcome page. I still keep an astronomical resource list in german which is based on your concept which I still find the most attractive and useful of all AstroWeb masterlist representations. Michael From astroweb-request Tue Jun 7 04:24:42 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA27036; Tue, 7 Jun 94 04:24:42 EDT Return-Path: Message-Id: <9406070824.AA00156@ns3.hq.eso.org> X-Sender: hmadorf@ns3.hq.eso.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 7 Jun 1994 10:26:16 +0100 To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU From: adorf@eso.org (Hans-Martin Adorf) Subject: remark by Bob Hanisch, STScI Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Would be good to have a paper [at the ADASS '94 conference] from the AstroWEB Consortium. Perhaps you [Hans-Martin] could organize that. Bob [Hanisch] [PS: Someone else volunteering?] From astroweb-request Tue Jun 7 05:25:08 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA28110; Tue, 7 Jun 94 05:25:08 EDT Return-Path: Message-Id: <9406070928.AA18871@cdsxb6.u-strasbg.fr> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Cc: heck@cdsxb6.u-strasbg.fr Subject: Paper on AstroWeb at ADASS'94 Date: Tue, 07 Jun 94 11:28:04 +0200 From: Andre HECK Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU As discussed in the past, Bob and myself (at least) will be attending ADASS'94 and we were ready to take care of such a paper/announcement. Who exactly is attending ADASS'94? Andre. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From astroweb-request Tue Jun 7 08:34:33 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA28278; Tue, 7 Jun 94 08:34:33 EDT Return-Path: From: fmurtagh@eso.org Date: Tue, 7 Jun 94 14:34:26 +0200 Message-Id: <9406071234.AA02585@st2.hq.eso.org> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: Re: Paper on AstroWeb at ADASS'94 Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Andre's message: I also hope to get to ADASS'94. Go ahead as per plan. In 2 months or so, I'll see about something for the ESO Messenger - perhaps partially on AstroWeb. (For the coming issue, I had to do something on the ESO Web). Two ideas... (1) Someone asked me recently for a copy of my hotlist. It is useless giving someone just a list of URLs, even if it is made HTML-readable. So I annotated my hotlist, ran a script on it to put it into HTML, and set it up in http://http.hq.eso.org/~fmurtagh/web-sites.html This can be waisindexed sometime in the future. There is a public 'bibl2html' utility which takes bibtex format as input, but I couldn't get this to work (and anyway, I am not totally emacs-based). The annotation procedure has to be kept simple. As opposed to the Mosaic annotation procedure, you need to see the comments before you decide to go to the URL. (Evidently this could be done by using one's hotlist file, and the annotation directory files, and creating an HTML file from these, which can then be accessed first. However being independent means more control over quality of comments, and also confidentiality of entries if desired - i.e. they don't have to be entered in the URL database.) Anyone else sharing hotlists? (2) Personal homepages can be quite informative (while still short), e.g. Karl Glazebrook, http://cast0.ast.cam.ac.uk/~kgb/ I think that personal research pages could be quite useful. But I am usually not interested in seeing CVs, or photos of weddings, or (out of date) pictures of the person, or phone numbers (which can be more efficiently obtained in other ways), etc. I want to check a personal homepage for the same reason that I might want to listen to such a person give a seminar or conf. talk. If one publishes a few papers on some topic, there are often additional vulgarisation papers (French sense!) also in such publications as the ESO Messenger, the ST-ECF Newsletter, etc. which may allow a better handle on the topic to someone wishing to get a quick introduction. So if I were to have a range of papers dealing with, e.g. wavelets and multiresolution in image processing, or forecasting seeing, or neural net approaches, etc., I think a range of introductory reading could be easily provided for access on the Web. I intend to set up something along these lines. I can imagine that a site dealing with other topics such as fractal-based methodologies, or (under)sampling problems, could be very valuable. This is ultimately not really different from the courseware and educational materials available on the Web; or the astronomical textbook being put together on the Web. Anyone else thinking of coordinating personal research pages like this? Or maintaining an annotated list of existing personal pages which have some real content? --Fionn From astroweb-request Tue Jun 7 11:38:30 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA28620; Tue, 7 Jun 94 11:38:30 EDT Return-Path: Date: Tue, 7 Jun 94 17:41:13 +0200 From: egret@SIMBAD.u-strasbg.fr (D. egret) Message-Id: <9406071541.AA24684@SIMBAD.u-strasbg.fr> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: Notes on the current status of AstroWeb Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Dear friends of AstroWeb, As announced in my last mail to Anton, I (I should say: we, as this is the result of discussions with Andre) would like to raise some questions on the current and future status of AstroWeb, after some two months of existence. 1. The original idea was to have an AstroWeb database, as complete and accurate as possible, kept up to date as quickly as possible, and with customized variations on the local sites. But I am afraid the last two months didn't show enough progress in this direction. Anton seems to have the most complete database, as of last week; but the overall strategy, as well as the strategy of each individual site (including ours!) is still largely unclear. 2. For better achieving a real efficient, well identified, AstroWeb database of reference, we need updating tools: these tools have been partially developed (mainly by Don and Bob since the beginning), but we failed to install a fully working system; see some suggestions below. 3. As a consequence of the current status of AstroWeb, the user cannot have a clear view of what AstroWeb is. Facing a number of different lists with heterogeneous coverage of the existing astronomical resources, the user has no way to know which one(s) he should use in order to best satisfy his requests. We also still see people installing copies of one or another of the AstroWeb files on their local server without giving any credit to the AstroWeb group (see e.g. the MPIfR Bonn and Universitaet Wien servers), thus increasing the confusion (and our frustration !). Our feeling is that if we cannot achieve to provide a "higher profile" of the AstroWeb work, we will not be able to convince the users that AstroWeb is the best place to search for links to astronomical Internet resources! 4. The reason why we insist in trying to provide a "top quality" AstroWeb, is that we feel it is the best way to help us keeping the sufficient motivation to maintain the database as accurate and complete as possible. Beyond the exciting development of new tools and new concepts, the task of maintaining the database, on a day-to-day basis, implies a level of motivation (in order to dedicate enough time to the task) which can only be achieved (at least that's our feeling as a result of our own experience) if the "AstroWeb product" is successful within the astronomical community, and if proper credit is given to the people in charge of the work... We would, therefore, like to propose some actions in order, to acquire and keep this status of "top quality database of reference". 5. The AstroWeb database: The firt two steps are probably: (1) to bring all the local versions of AstroWeb to the same completeness level (i.e. something like the 883 URLs mentioned in Anton's message of last week) (2) to install the updating tools needed for additions, corrections and deletions of URLs, and for eventual mirror copies, in all the five sites. These tools should be as automatic as possible, even if some human supervision is still needed... Obviously we know how to achieve these two steps (from our discussions when the AstroWeb consortium was first set up). So, this probably means now: let's find the way to devote sufficient time in the next weeks (before the end of June ?) to the full installation of the tools, and to the coordination between the different sites. 6. AstroWeb policy: 6.1 We need to enter into the details of an AstroWeb policy: who is doing what; what is the role of each site; we also need to set up aims, and decide on methods and schedules for achieving them. An example is the policy on additions, corrections and deletions. Among the possible strategies: one is to have each new finding circulated in a useful form (the inp_incoming file ? the astroweb exploder ? automatic checking of the difference between files ?); another one is to feed information into a central database (with the very promising tools built up by Bob). In the updating process, our appreciation of the relevance or qualification of a link may differ: we need to discuss how to sort that out. 6.2 With soon more than 1000 URLs we need to provide database tools and search mechanisms to help the user find his/her way in the jungle. These tools have to be discussed and optimized. Here again we know how to do it, and merely need to dicuss how to best implement them. For example, Andre has now decided to replace his files of anchors for organizations and for individuals by a simple form interface to a search mechanism. This also implies that we may choose to give access to the information without giving access to the whole file (thus preventing unwanted local copies). 6.3 The addition of descriptive texts, with the anchors is a very long task, generating a series of questions (inhomegeneity, etc.). We have to find the best answers to this problem, and to keep the procedure as simple as possible... 6.4 At the end, we should be able also to direct the user to a specific site, either for geographical reason, organisation (different sorting), search mechanism, etc. 6.5 We also need to discuss the general policy of inclusion of new resources: do we want to add extra care in the selection of the posted material: i.e. at the end should we go to a kind of refereeing system ? We want to avoid in the meantime to post "empty" services, and we need to keep track of the changing addresses... 7. Sharing the work ? As a practical point, a way to be more efficient could be to share the work on a domain basis, such as letting Andre maintain the "individuals" list, or asking me to maintain the "Databases and Archives" domain. The responsible of a domain could combine his own findings with the ones sent by the other members of the consortium, or by the "incoming" files, etc. 8. AstroWeb visibility: - Papers are in press in Astronomy&Astrophysics, and in the CDS Information Bulletin; there are other good places for such announcements: local Newsletters, IAU commissions, colloquia (CODATA, ADASS, NCSA, etc.). - We could give more visibility to the "AstroWeb concept" on the AstroWeb pages themselves (including a sentence encouraging to point to the AstroWeb pages rather to copy a *quickly outdated* page). This is currently present only in a fraction of the AstroWeb pages. - An AstroWeb logo would be a very important addition to our AstroWeb pages; this has already been mentioned once; does anybody have suggestions ? A meeting of the whole group would be very welcomed in order to help setting up a common policy, and planning future perspectives. If you agree, an opportunity could be in Europe this summer, around the IAU General Assembly: we could plan a meeting either in The Hague, or somewhere else in Europe (Strasbourg might be a convenient place !). The alternative would be to keep using the e-mail... Looking forward to reading your reactions ! Best regards Daniel From astroweb-request Tue Jun 7 12:35:49 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA28850; Tue, 7 Jun 94 12:35:49 EDT Return-Path: Message-Id: <9406071638.AA27785@cdsxb6.u-strasbg.fr> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Cc: heck@cdsxb6.u-strasbg.fr Subject: AstroWeb logo Date: Tue, 07 Jun 94 18:38:55 +0200 From: Andre HECK Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Further to Point 8 of Daniel's message, I just noticed that ADS was organizing a logo contest. What about us doing the same via a message on NCSA `What's New' file? -> possibility to get a good logo and some additional advertizing for AW. AH. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From astroweb-request Thu Jun 9 12:43:26 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA03393; Thu, 9 Jun 94 12:43:26 EDT Return-Path: From: fmurtagh@eso.org Date: Thu, 9 Jun 94 18:43:20 +0200 Message-Id: <9406091643.AA08499@st2.hq.eso.org> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: new astron site Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU New Web site (it'll grow...): http://http.hq.eso.org/lisa-ii.html (LISA-II, Libarary and Informations Services in Astronomy II conference, May 1995). --Fionn From astroweb-request Fri Jun 10 03:03:23 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA04827; Fri, 10 Jun 94 03:03:23 EDT Return-Path: Message-Id: <9406100651.AA15576@ns3.hq.eso.org> X-Sender: hmadorf@ns3.hq.eso.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 10 Jun 1994 08:53:18 +0100 To: Bob Hanisch From: adorf@eso.org (Hans-Martin Adorf) Subject: Re: ADASS '94 Cc: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Dear Bob, thanks for drawing my/our attention to the special meeting on electronic prepress taking place after the ADASS conference. Certainly I am interested, though I might raise views which are minority views at this point in time. One thing that interests me (after the usual format problems have been sorted out) is information searching (using e.g. WAIS or Z39.50) and configurable information filtering (including automated alerts via e-mail). I am right now experimenting with an information filter built in into Eudora 2.0, a mail popper which I am using on my Mac for handling e-mail. It is configured to sort incoming mail into 4 in-boxes (ST-ECF, STScI, ESO and other) and, depending on the sender, may raise the message's priority. Content-based filtering operations are also possible, but I am not using them right now. I am mentioning this because such a local filter could be exploited in a distributed electronic alert system with specified and published keywords acting as a triggers for local information filtering. Let me know if you want me to speak up on this issue. Cheers Hans-Martin From astroweb-request Fri Jun 10 08:58:31 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA06036; Fri, 10 Jun 94 08:58:31 EDT Return-Path: Date: Fri, 10 Jun 94 22:58:07 EST From: anton@mso.anu.edu.au (anton koekemoer) Message-Id: <9406101258.AA02949@merlin.anu.edu.au> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: Notes on the current status of AstroWeb Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Dear friends, Here are some of my thoughts regarding Daniel/Andre's comments. Apologies for not replying to each point in turn; some of the paragraphs below cover a number of points simultaneously (while I'll leave other points for later discussion). However the structure of Daniel's email is useful; it may be a good idea to keep adding to that file, letting it serve as a repository for the ideas resulting from our discussions. Firstly, I agree that AstroWeb should have a clearly stated, well-defined purpose, preferably one that will be able to take into account the constant appearance of new types of services on the web. One way of addressing this may be to talk about the question "why are we doing this?" Personally, I spend as much time using AstroWeb as I do maintaining it; I tend to use it to look for anything that can help with my research. One use involves looking for information about "departments" (ie any place where researchers are based (semi-)full-time and whose work is published in the major astronomical journals). What I'm interested in are annual reports, research interests (general and individual), colloquium schedules, job opportunities. Many departments don't have much information available yet but some do. I'm also interested in any telescopes which I could apply for time on, particularly their instrumentation, manuals and observing schedules. In addition I use the databases (observational and literature) and regularly check the lists of meetings and jobs. I would not expect this to be representative of a general usage pattern for AstroWeb, it's just an example to get the discussion going. So as a starting point for discussion, how about the following aims: 1) Be as comprehensive and up-to-date as possible. - provide information of relevance and use to anyone doing research in astrophysics, or involved with supporting it - provide a forum where departments/individuals can publicise their activities in the knowledge that it will be seen as widely as possible. 2) Present the information in a number of different ways. It seems to me that there are 3 general presentation strategies, all of which are useful and should be kept: - search mechanisms (Bob, Daniel/Andre) - classify by access protocol (Bob) - possibly sub-classify by service - classify by service (my list, Don's and Hans-Martin) In order to achieve (1) we need to actively encourage the community to contribute to AstroWeb - since advertising their activities is ultimately of mutual benefit to everyone (otherwise what is the point of the internet). A practical way of doing this, closely related to raising the profile of AstroWeb, may be for most sites to have some consistent way of referring to it. We should probably provide this; something along the lines of a short paragraph (2 - 3 sentences) explaining what AstroWeb is all about and encouraging anyone involved in astrophysics research to contribute to it (and actually include, for example, pointers to Don's scripts). Perhaps we should start contacting the maintainers of home-pages, firstly those who have copied astroweb databases and secondly those who still refer to only one of the versions, and offer them such a "standard" paragraph. As well as perhaps pointing out the benefits of what AstroWeb is on about. It is worth noting here that a number of sites have done their best to give AstroWeb a high profile - eg ATNF, WebStars. But the ability for users to contribute should be emphasised much more - (along the lines of "AstroWeb: *the* place to be seen!" :) ). I also agree that a logo competition would be a great way to raise its profile even further. I like the current mechanisms for contributing to AstroWeb, whereby people use the forms to input URLs into a specific file and these are then added to the database at our discretion (possibly modifying them slightly for the sake of consistency). But this will only work well (ie- be popular with the community in general) if the changes are implemented relatively soon, within 24 hours or so of them being added. If this happens then contributions from others may be much more forthcoming. I suggest below that any new URLs found by us should also go into the same file. As for keeping AstroWeb up-to-date with a minimum of effort, I'd agree that the first step should definitely be for all sites to be brought to the same level of completeness. This is probably best achieved by using Don's awk scripts to create each astroweb presentation from the same master database file (currently yp_topzone.html, although a more fundamental set of input files is inp_*.html). As far as I know this is already the case for all sites except CDS; however it should be quite easy to adapt the scripts so that the two CDS databases can be created from yp_topzone.html. This would of course involve first adding to the database all the CDS URLs which are not currently there. Don's current system firstly uses inp_*.html to create yp_topzone.html, and then uses yp_topzone.html to create whichever AstroWeb presentation is being asked for in the 'make' command. My implementation of this uses the following input files: 23278 Jun 1 20:19 inp_cds.html 605 Jun 10 20:32 inp_mssso.html 221350 Jun 6 22:37 inp_nrao.html 0 May 7 21:46 inp_stecf.html 0 May 7 21:46 inp_stsci.html If we all have an identical version of AstroWeb, then these files could each become the general input file for each particular site. For example, in order to keep my version up-to-date, I would (1) add new URLs to inp_mssso.html as I discover them (and check/fix those that others have added to this file via the input form), and (2) use an automatic script which regularly fetches inp_cds.html from CDS, inp_nrao.html from NRAO, etc. and then re-makes the database after it has fetched all the input files (re-making all the presentations, not just the 'mssso' one). All the above is currently in place, except for the fact that all the above input files need to be brought into existence at the other sites. (I also can't get 'aref1' to work in order to allow my inp_mssso.html to be changed but I probably just need some advice here..). [The idea of each of us having an input file is simply to distribute the load evenly; if there is only "master" input file then it does place some extra responsibility on the person at that site, and seems to introduce some reluctance on the part of the other members to make changes to it.] We could also use the astroweb exploder to announce particularly interesting new sites; however I would view this as an optional extra, the primary input mechanism being inp_*.html. What do you all feel about this way of keeping things up-to-date? If we all have the same collection of AstroWeb presentations, this would also start to reduce the importance of their physical location. One option then is to have the same AstroWeb "home page" at each of our sites, and in that home page refer to 2 things: 1) links pointing to the local copies of each of the different presentations, but listing them by their classification details rather than their geographical origin. 2) pointers to the other AstroWeb home pages, listing them by continent (with the institution in brackets) and pointing out that this is purely for the sake of network speed and convenience. I'll make up such a draft homepage for the purposes of illustration/discussion, although if anyone else would like to do so then please feel free. Another question, relating perhaps to our name 'consortium': what are the implications for involvement on the part of our institutions? In other words, what happens when we move to other institutions? This may in fact be happening for me in the near future, as I'll probably be leaving MSSSO to take up a postdoc at the Institut d'Astrophysique de Paris; but it should form an important part of our policy in general. I would expect to continue remaining just as involved with AstroWeb, since I view it as an on-going collaboration between ourselves, and through my discussions at MSSSO it is clear that they don't feel any formal obligation towards either AstroWeb itself or any of the other institutions. But the prominence of this question will be reduced somewhat if we all have identical copies of the lists and emphasise their different styles of classification. The "sites" will then primarily serve as local mirrors, which could be of increasing importance in the near future if network traffic continues to increase. I'd still believe in giving credit where its due - but perhaps by using a separate page listing our names and current affiliations, in a similar fashion to the title/abstract page of a paper. Looking forward to continued discussion... cheers, - anton. From www_server Tue Jun 14 11:01:59 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA15215; Tue, 14 Jun 94 11:01:59 EDT Return-Path: Date: Tue, 14 Jun 94 11:01:56 EDT From: www_server@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU (httpd@fits.cv.nrao.edu) Message-Id: <9406141501.AA15206@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU, pfennige@scsun.unige.ch Subject: database correction Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Message entered by: pfenniger @ obslx2.unige.ch [129.194.65.62] My name is mispelled in the following abstract reference: 1991A&A...252...75P PFENNINGER, D.;FRIEDLI, D. Structure and dynamics of 3D N-body galaxies ^ it should read: PFENNIGER, D.; etc...  Thanks, Daniel Pfenniger From astroweb-request Tue Jun 14 11:47:26 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA15355; Tue, 14 Jun 94 11:47:26 EDT Return-Path: Message-Id: <9406141547.AA16901@ns3.hq.eso.org> X-Sender: hmadorf@ns3.hq.eso.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 14 Jun 1994 17:47:19 +0100 To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU From: Peter Linde (by way of adorf@eso.org (Hans-Martin Adorf)) Subject: Lund Home Page Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Hi Hans-Martin, How are things? Just wanted to tell you that you might consider to include the Lund Observatory WWW Home Page in your list: http://nastol.astro.lu.se/Html/home.html See you! Peter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Peter Linde Tel: +46-46-104701 Lund Observatory E-mail: peter@astro.lu.se (Internet) Box 43 Fax: +46-46-104614 S-221 00 Lund Sweden ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From astroweb-request Tue Jun 14 12:27:56 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA15468; Tue, 14 Jun 94 12:27:56 EDT Return-Path: Date: Tue, 14 Jun 94 12:27:47 EDT From: Bob Jackson Message-Id: <9406141627.AA05031@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> To: pfennige@scsun.unige.ch Subject: [www_server@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU: database correction] Reply-To: jackson@stsci.edu Cc: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU w.r.t. ************************** My name is mispelled in the following abstract reference: 1991A&A...252...75P PFENNINGER, D.;FRIEDLI, D. Structure and dynamics of 3D N-body galaxies ^ it should read: PFENNIGER, D.; etc...  Thanks, Daniel Pfenniger ************************** Alas we (AstroWeb) have absolutely no control over any abstract references. I suggest you contact the owner of the abstract index. Bob From astroweb-request Tue Jun 14 14:58:24 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA15733; Tue, 14 Jun 94 14:58:24 EDT Return-Path: Date: Tue, 14 Jun 94 14:58:16 EDT From: Bob Jackson Message-Id: <9406141858.AA05080@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Subject: Group Editing Reply-To: jackson@stsci.edu Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU In an effort to improve the maintainability of the AstroWeb Database, I have created some tools to allow each one of us to edit the database. This should free Don of the onus of doing all the editing himself. This should allow us all to use the same database. ********************************************************* Operations Concept: Everyone edits the central database as needed Everyone grabs the database contents periodically Everyone creates their local reports on the database I could write reports to satisfy each site, but the above approach allows you complete control of the presentation at your site. ********************************************************* The entrance point is: http://lor.stsci.edu/astroweb/astroweb-cvs.html Rather than storing the data in HTML, I chose to store it in raw TCL. http://lor.stsci.edu/astroweb/master.tcl (It eliminates parsing the HTML everytime.) The interface supports: * ADD New Resource HTML form to enter a new resource. Note this form enforces a finite set of CATEGORIES. If more categories are needed, then let me know. There are resources in the database which have Categories not supported by the interface. ??? What should be done with these ??? * DELETE Existing Resource A page of HTML to choose which resource to delete. * EDIT Entire Database HTML form to transfer entire database. Can edit in the form OR SAVE AS and use your editor The load action requires a CATEGORY for each URL * LOG of Database Changes To see who made changes when. User comments describing changes are only provided with the EDIT Entire Database action. *HTML Version of Database Generate HTML like yp_master.html. Also accessable via: http://lor.stsci.edu/cgi-bin/astrowebedit/html// If you want to generate your local version of the database, you can: Grab the HTML version and reformat by your favorite tool. OR Grab the master.tcl file and use Tcl to do the reformatting. Sample Tcl code is available at http://lor.stsci.edu/astroweb/tcl-code Look at the 'proc's showhtml sorturls getdomain transdomain From astroweb-request Wed Jun 15 16:50:36 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA19344; Wed, 15 Jun 94 16:50:36 EDT Return-Path: Date: Wed, 15 Jun 94 16:50:25 EDT From: Bob Jackson Message-Id: <9406152050.AA07821@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Subject: whose is the biggest Reply-To: jackson@stsci.edu Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Who has the biggest | most complete database? I will process it and load it into my AstroWeb Edit stuff. Bob From astroweb-request Thu Jun 16 08:44:21 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA21523; Thu, 16 Jun 94 08:44:21 EDT Return-Path: Date: Thu, 16 Jun 94 22:44:01 EST From: anton@mso.anu.edu.au (anton koekemoer) Message-Id: <9406161244.AA02164@merlin.anu.edu.au> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: Re: whose is the biggest Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Dear friends, Bob queries: > Who has the biggest | most complete database? I'm not sure what the current status of all the other databases is, but here's my version of it: http://meteor.anu.edu.au/anton/yp_topzone.html This has 910 records; it started life as a copy of yp_topzone.html from NRAO in mid-April and has been growing since, currently being updated every 24h. It includes all the (usable) links from inp_incoming.html (NRAO) and all the 'personal' CDS URLs. A few older URLs have been fixed so that they work; in addition slight changes have been made to some URL titles (particularly university departments), primarily for the sake of consistency. Note that this database could still do with a lot of improvements, particularly in the area of consistent URL titles (not to mention descriptions...) I also never had the time to merge the CDS 'institutions' records with it. However, feel free to fetch it. cheers, - anton. From astroweb-request Thu Jun 16 08:46:35 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA21542; Thu, 16 Jun 94 08:46:35 EDT Return-Path: Date: Thu, 16 Jun 94 22:46:23 EST From: anton@mso.anu.edu.au (anton koekemoer) Message-Id: <9406161246.AA02202@merlin.anu.edu.au> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: Re: whose is the biggest Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU PS: Note that this file yp_topzone.html is in fact created afresh every day from the inp_*.html files, as I described in an earlier email; however it still has the same form as the original. From astroweb-request Thu Jun 16 12:11:36 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA21930; Thu, 16 Jun 94 12:11:36 EDT Return-Path: Message-Id: <9406161615.AA26289@SIMBAD.u-strasbg.fr> To: astroweb@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Subject: yp_topzone file Date: Thu, 16 Jun 94 18:15:01 +0200 From: egret@SIMBAD.u-strasbg.fr X-Mts: smtp Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Anton, As a complement to your last message: I have tested last week the differences between CDS files (organizations and individuals) and your main file (yp_topzone), and found 199 anchors that were in our file and not in yours, and 454 anchors in your file and not in CDS's. However this is just the result of an automatic search, and this has of course to be studied in more details... More work to be done ! Daniel ===================================================================== From astroweb-request Thu Jun 16 15:26:14 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA22153; Thu, 16 Jun 94 15:26:14 EDT Return-Path: Date: Thu, 16 Jun 94 15:26:08 EDT From: Bob Jackson Message-Id: <9406161926.AA12378@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Subject: AstroWeb Edit repository Reply-To: jackson@stsci.edu Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU I have put all of Anton's yptoplev.html into my TCL-CVS database. So if people want to start using it... I will start putting my backlog into it. http://lor.stsci.edu/astroweb/tcl-code contains sample code to reformat the TCL database into HTML files similar to yptoplev.html. Bob From astroweb-request Tue Jun 21 11:31:10 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA05723; Tue, 21 Jun 94 11:31:10 EDT Return-Path: Date: Tue, 21 Jun 94 11:31:03 EDT From: Bob Jackson Message-Id: <9406211531.AA20655@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Subject: Changes to AstroWeb at STScI Reply-To: jackson@stsci.edu Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU I am now driving the AstroWeb listings at STScI by the data in the AstroWebEdit database at STScI. I took Anton's listing and added my Email backlog to create the database at STScI. Hopefully this list is now fairly complete. I will next go through the Mosaic What's New pages and look for more entries. The STScI pages now include a listing sorted by Category,Title The code used to create sorted-by-protocol and sorted-by-category listings is at http://stsci.edu/astroweb-html/reformat-master The combination of AstroWebEdit at http://lor.stsci.edu/astroweb/astroweb-cvs.html and http://stsci.edu/astroweb-html/reformat-master or similar tools will allow us to update the central database without any intervention by me or Don or ... and to create our local versions. IS THIS WHAT WE NEED FOR FAST UPDATES? I intend to add an ability to get earlier versions of the database, should someone make a mistake. Bob From www_server Wed Jun 22 11:48:36 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA02074; Wed, 22 Jun 94 11:48:36 EDT Return-Path: Date: Wed, 22 Jun 94 11:48:32 EDT From: www_server@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU (httpd@fits.cv.nrao.edu) Message-Id: <9406221548.AA02065@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU, gei@cfa.harvard.edu Subject: ADS Abstract Service Upgrade Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Message entered by: Guenther Eichhorn @ adssun.harvard.edu [128.103.41.124] The Astrophysics Data System (ADS) Abstract Service provides access to currently over 160,000 Astronomy and Astrophysics abstracts with a sophisticated searching system. Using Lynx, this also provides access to this service from character based terminals. The search capability now also includes object name searches through a connection to the SIMBAD database in France. More information about this service is available in the Abstract Service Help Pages.

From www_server Thu Jun 23 15:38:40 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA04978; Thu, 23 Jun 94 15:38:40 EDT Return-Path: Date: Thu, 23 Jun 94 15:38:37 EDT From: www_server@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU (httpd@fits.cv.nrao.edu) Message-Id: <9406231938.AA04969@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU, mink@cfa.harvard.edu Subject: HTML pointer to my software Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Message entered by: Doug Mink @ cfa165.harvard.edu [131.142.10.160] The entry in "Software Resources" for RVSAO, RGSC, SKYMAP Software should be html://tdc-www.harvard.edu/TDC.html. Individual entries for these packages are: RVSAO, an IRAF package for finding radial velocities from spectra RGSC a program for searching the Hubble Space Telescope Guide Star Catalog SKYMAP a program for mapping star catalogs onto the sky From astroweb-request Thu Jun 23 16:39:48 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA05030; Thu, 23 Jun 94 16:39:48 EDT Return-Path: Date: Thu, 23 Jun 94 16:39:37 EDT From: Bob Jackson Message-Id: <9406232039.AA26287@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Subject: How to update AstroWeb Reply-To: jackson@stsci.edu Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Before I make any fatal or offensive mistakes... I, perhaps incorrectly, perceived that Don did not always have time to update the master database at NRAO. Thus I build the tool at lor.stsci.edu to allow any of us to edit a New database at STSCI. This was intended to lift any onus off of Don and to speed changes to the database. Should be abandon the NRAO database for the STSCI database? Are any more tools or output products needed before other site are willing to abandon the NRAO database? How should people other than us enter their additions, deletions, and changes to the AstroWeb database? 1. Use Don's HTML forms at NRAO OR 2. Send email to astroweb@nrao.edu Bob From dwells Fri Jun 24 12:59:40 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA06917; Fri, 24 Jun 94 12:59:40 EDT Return-Path: Date: Fri, 24 Jun 94 12:59:33 EDT From: dwells@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU (Don Wells) Message-Id: <9406241659.AA06905@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: jackson@stsci.edu Cc: astroweb@NRAO.EDU Subject: Re: How to update AstroWeb In-Reply-To: <9406232039.AA26287@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> References: <9406232039.AA26287@MARIAN.STSCI.EDU> Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Bob Jackson writes: > I.. perceived that Don > did not always have time to update the master > database at NRAO. That was a correct perception of me (Don). The condition is (probably) not permanent (see below). > Thus I build the tool at > lor.stsci.edu to allow any of us to edit > a New database at STSCI. This was intended > to lift any onus off of Don and to speed > changes to the database. That is fine with me. I have made it clear from the beginning that I did not want to act as a central clearing-house. I prepared technology that allowed us to organize the database, and to transform it for presentation purposes, and I personally worked rather hard for many weeks to make the merged database be a reality, but I did not really want to make long-term promises about my ability to continually dedicate a fraction of my time to the effort. It is more likely that I will concentrate on it for occasional brief periods and will catch up, and may even advance the database to new levels, but then will begin to fall behind again. I know that that is the way I am, and so I was reluctant to commit to operate a unique central database that requires continuous manual effort. I am not the right person for that role. > Should be abandon the NRAO database for > the STSCI database? You will hear no objection from me; I will cheerfully switch to your database if others agree. I urge that you (Bob) also avoid committing yourself to a long-term continual maintenance role. It appears to me that that will not happen with your new technology -- you only need to keep the daemons running. I expect that they are likely to operate automatically for extended periods of time. With a team of people available to work on the database, we will be able to "cover" for each other for various periods of time. > How should people other than us enter their > additions, deletions, and changes to the > AstroWeb database? > 1. Use Don's HTML forms at NRAO Any of you are welcome to install copies of that technology elsewhere, perhaps with improvements. > 2. Send email to astroweb@nrao.edu While Email will always work, it is an inefficient mechanism for this purpose. It will be better to use mechanisms which organize and code the information in a format which is as compatible as possible with the format of the database. The form interface imposes _order_ and _consistency_ on the input data. -Don From dwells Tue Jun 28 16:32:57 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA08188; Tue, 28 Jun 94 16:32:57 EDT Return-Path: Date: Tue, 28 Jun 94 16:32:55 EDT From: dwells (Don Wells) Message-Id: <9406282032.AA08182@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: astroweb Subject: Change at NRAO Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Dear AstroWeb friends, My pages at http://fits.cv.nrao.edu/www/astronomy.html have changed. They are now computed from the STScI database (875 records). It follows that file ftp://fits.cv.nrao.edu/fits/www/yp_master.html is now a version of the STScI database. I fetch the STScI database with a command like this lynx -source http://lor.stsci.edu/astroweb/newmaster.html >mycopy.html The Lynx executable I am using is: Lynx Version 2.3 BETA (c)1994 University of Kansas I have tried Bob's form for making changes. I introduced two changes to the STScI database, then did a new download and computed new pages. My command for doing this is 'make get_master install'. Once I am confident that this is working reliably, I expect to add this command to my daily crontab daemon. I will be away on a trip for the next 4 days; I expect to be read my Email again on the evening of Sunday 03 July. Regards, Don From www_server Wed Jun 29 16:54:11 1994 Received: by fits.cv.nrao.edu (4.1/DDN-DLB/1.5) id AA10546; Wed, 29 Jun 94 16:54:11 EDT Return-Path: Date: Wed, 29 Jun 94 16:54:05 EDT From: www_server@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU (httpd@fits.cv.nrao.edu) Message-Id: <9406292054.AA10537@fits.cv.nrao.edu> To: astroweb@NRAO.EDU, kneale@gemini.edu Subject: Text with the Gemini Project description Sender: astroweb-request@fits.CV.NRAO.EDU Message entered by: Ruth Kneale @ hephaestus.gemini.edu [140.252.15.172] Can you please change the text description that goes with our link at the AstroWeb sites, to read the following? "The Gemini 8m Telescopes Project is an international project to build two infrared-optimized telescopes. One telescope will be located on Mauna Kea, Hawaii; the other will be on Cerro Pachon, Chile." It just reads a bit smoother. Many thanks, Ruth Kneale Web Page Maintainer Gemini Project